Jamie Heron, a movement teacher and personal friend, joins us. We laugh a lot, and we talk about authenticity, taking up space, and challenging societal expectations as forms of resistance and empowered development.
We explore how movement practices are interconnected and why it can be empowering to move beyond identifying with certain labels and dogmas, to create freedom for exploring their essences and the relationships they invite us to explore.
We also talk community building, fashion and personal style, and fear and process as a natural part of growth.
Weekly stories by email from Bonnie’s HERE
Connect with Bonnie: Instagram, Email (hello@bonnieweeks.com), Website
Listen to Bonnie's other podcast Sexy Sunday HERE
The music for this episode is Threads by The Light Meeting.
Produced by: Grey Tanner
Jamie Heron, a movement teacher and personal friend, joins us. We laugh a lot, and we talk about authenticity, taking up space, and challenging societal expectations as forms of resistance and empowered development.
We explore how movement practices are interconnected and why it can be empowering to move beyond identifying with certain labels and dogmas, to create freedom for exploring their essences and the relationships they invite us to explore.
We also talk community building, fashion and personal style, and fear and process as a natural part of growth.
Weekly stories by email from Bonnie’s HERE
Connect with Bonnie: Instagram, Email (hello@bonnieweeks.com), Website
Listen to Bonnie's other podcast Sexy Sunday HERE
The music for this episode is Threads by The Light Meeting.
Produced by: Grey Tanner
Bonnie (00:02.006)
Welcome back to the podcast, My Party People. I really fucking love bringing guests on that are showing up in the world, owning the hell out of what they're doing, doing it in their own style. And it just makes me love people more. It truly does. I love it when people give themselves permission to be themselves. And if you've been here for a second with me, you know that is the case. So today,
I have somebody with me that is a friend, that is a teacher, that is pretty badass at what she's creating in the world. And I even say that with like the asterisks of, we're always in the middle of creation. And I love people, I feel like I'm in the process of always creating myself. So I love meeting people who are like, I'm in the process of creating and figuring out what.
that even means. And so this is somebody with all of that full energy. My challenge to you is going to be that if, as you listen that you laugh zero times. That's gonna be my challenge because I'm pretty damn sure it is going to be impossible. So the guest today that I have with me for our conversation is somebody who teaches Pilates. And that even like,
that doesn't feel sufficient to like say that, but that is a role that this person plays. This is somebody who I've watched jump into strength training. This is somebody who's been a part of dance. This is somebody who's interested in fashion and sustainable fashion and active wear. This is somebody who wants to talk about bodies and the way we tell stories about bodies and how we tell stories about ourselves and how we wanna build lives that matter and matter to us and matter to others. This is somebody who
is really interested in empowering people to own their shit and to embrace who they are and to be on that journey. And I fucking love Jamie. So welcome to the podcast, Jamie. And one of the things that I also love is this list of things is because you are so damn witty. Like I love your sense of humor. I love your sarcasm. I love...
Bonnie (02:28.15)
Sometimes the dryness of it that is, it just, it makes me laugh so much. Welcome to the podcast. Yes, please.
Jamie Fearn (02:34.916)
Is this the part where I talk? Okay, great. That's so many things. It's funny when you hear people talk about yourself, right? Because all of a sudden you're like, whoa, I do all those things. But then like earlier today I was like, do I even do anything with myself? So it's very cool to hear all of those things are all very sweet, very kind. I will warn you, my wiener dog has a...
Bonnie (02:44.737)
Mm-hmm.
Jamie Fearn (03:03.988)
We'll call it a proclivity maybe to, well, when he's, I don't know how to say this, when he's not getting enough attention, which we all probably do this, we can be honest here, he has a proclivity to hump people's feet. So if I'm like seeming, you know, embarrassed or exasperated, it's probably because he's down there doing that. And I think it should, I think we're good. He's not in here right now.
but he has free reign, he might come by. And maybe that could tie in with your sexy Sunday stories, you know, weiner dog humping.
Bonnie (03:33.74)
Mm-hmm.
Bonnie (03:41.653)
Yeah.
Yeah, I mean, we're like, we're just going to post like double podcast post this both on Yoga Strong and Sexy Sunday be like, there's just going to be some humping in this.
Jamie Fearn (03:46.087)
Uh.
Jamie Fearn (03:51.028)
Perfect. Yeah, yeah. Maybe there's a separate segment where Hank speaks to us. Hank is my dog, just so everyone's clear, about his situation as expressive.
Bonnie (04:04.81)
Yeah. I mean, are any of us like you said, are any of us exempt from doing some humping when we feel like we want some attention, right?
Jamie Fearn (04:15.412)
Well, no, I think that's a great way to like relieve stress, right? Fill in the blank with whatever, but we all know what we're talking about here. Um, yeah, sure. I mean, I get it. I'm not saying I don't get it. I'm just saying it can be kind of. It's just weird when it's your feet and you're technically his mom, you know? Not to say that I birthed him, but I feel like I did. So anyway, thank you.
Bonnie (04:22.914)
Yeah. Go hump.
Bonnie (04:39.898)
Yes. Okay, we will. Please let us know. Please keep us updated on Hank's situation and on your feet situation. Ha ha ha.
Jamie Fearn (04:46.148)
Yeah, I will for sure. Yes, right now they're here. Very cool. I'm sorry, anyway, were we doing something? Oh yeah, podcast. Thank you for having me. This is very exciting. This is a dream come true. I feel popular, I feel famous, I feel cool. And I'm excited to just chat. I really think all of the things you mentioned are really true about me. And I love that you mentioned
Bonnie (04:56.854)
Mm-hmm.
Jamie Fearn (05:18.513)
I say I'm a Pilates instructor often because that is literally what I do, but it does not feel like enough. I mean, I just, and more and more I'm finding myself maybe like stepping away from labels like that, specific labels for movement practices. Like I teach Pilates, but really I teach people how to move. And I started strength training, I think a year ago now, about a year ago.
Bonnie (05:45.31)
No longer than that. Yeah, because I was in your very first class. And not Springs.
Jamie Fearn (05:46.92)
Has it been longer?
Jamie Fearn (05:52.904)
for strength training?
Bonnie (05:54.398)
Mm-hmm. We went to, we were in a strength and conditioning class.
Jamie Fearn (05:58.856)
That's right. How about that? Wow, yeah, so a while ago, that's like two years probably. Yeah, huh, okay, so I started a lot longer ago than I thought. Really started getting consistent with it, probably about a year, around this time last year actually. And yeah, so I do, I started that, I started strength training for myself and then I said, oh.
Bonnie (06:00.278)
Mm-hmm.
Bonnie (06:06.414)
Yeah.
Jamie Fearn (06:27.472)
let me get another certification because that's kind of what I do. And so I ended up getting my personal training certificate and I just, I combine the two. I find it like happening. I combine three because I also have a background with dance and I just keep seeing like it's all movement, you know? I haven't actually made my way to yoga much yet, which is maybe a little funny, but like I feel like that'll happen.
you know, give me another year or two, I'll be looking for a certification. But yeah, it's just, I just don't, less and less I am finding myself caring about labels as like, this is my certification that I got, or this is my background. Like, it's all just movement, you know? And people get so hung up on, this is the only way you should do this. And this is, I think,
Bonnie (06:55.616)
Mm-hmm.
Bonnie (07:16.749)
Mm-hmm.
Jamie Fearn (07:22.732)
when I started out, I kind of had that thought. Like when I started dance, I was like, ballet is obviously the only way, which is very like, not true. And I did the same thing with Pilates. I was like, well, obviously Pilates is the only way. And then I did the same when I started teaching bar. I was like, clearly bar is the only thing people should do. And then I did the same with strength training for a little minute. I was like, this is the only thing that you'll ever need. And that's just not true.
You know, we are, and I think you say it a lot too, which is probably where I heard it. We are more than one thing, right? And we get so limited in these moments where we're looking for the one thing to do. And it's so much more freeing to just do as many things as you want. It's all the same. I am constantly seeing parallels in my strength classes.
Bonnie (07:52.759)
Mm.
Bonnie (08:01.376)
Mm-hmm.
Jamie Fearn (08:22.332)
versus Pilates classes, versus dance classes, versus bar. It's all the fricking same. And yeah, so I think I just, the evolution is interesting to me. And I like that you mentioned the part about like acknowledging that we're never really like fully formed. You know, I have no idea what I'm doing any given day. And I keep thinking like I'm much more
Bonnie (08:44.744)
Mm-hmm.
Bonnie (08:48.247)
Yeah.
Jamie Fearn (08:53.008)
like intuitive than I was maybe a year ago and I feel like I'm maybe starting some kind of a path to something, but I don't know what it is, but I know I'm getting helpful, helpful information along the way.
Bonnie (09:01.729)
Yeah.
Bonnie (09:07.914)
Yeah. Well, and I guess I, as you're talking about all of these things, it's kind of making me giggle to be like, you know, you're here on Yoga Strong. This, where I'm like centering the word yoga in a way of what we're talking about. I mean, clearly there's a lot of episodes around things that are maybe not yoga movement. But why invite you here? And I think you just have done a
really good job of saying, but it's more than one thing. And I'm more than one thing. And our movement all informs us of ourselves in a lot of different ways. And it impacts not just our physical self, but all of the other parts of ourself too. And I am, I love boundary pushing people and people who are interested in expanding what they think about themselves.
what they think is possible for the people they work with and what has been created in the world and how they can say like, but can it be done in a different way? Like I love the energy that people bring to that and that is why you are here is because you're one of those people and the bravery and trust you have to play with in order to step into that space, it's scary.
Like, what am I doing? This is great. I'm just gonna go sit down now. Right, like so it requires a lot to step into that space.
Jamie Fearn (10:26.972)
Yeah. Really?
Jamie Fearn (10:31.804)
Yeah, exactly.
Jamie Fearn (10:35.772)
I think it's scary and I think it's another one of those situations where like, I, hearing you say that I'm doing that, I'm like, oh yeah, I guess I am. But really for me, it's just feeling scared a lot. I'm not necessarily thinking like, oh, I'm really doing this big thing. It's like, I'm going to shit my pants, you know? Like, I mean, not really, but you know, maybe, I don't know. Anyway, there is an...
Bonnie (10:55.883)
Yeah.
Jamie Fearn (11:03.076)
I don't know how much you want to get into this, but within the Pilates community, there is a huge divide on like, and I think this, I'm sure this shows up in yoga as well, classical versus contemporary and like, you know, how do we do, what are we doing? And is it classical or is it like loosely based off of classical or is it?
something that's like the true Pilates versus, is it something that is made up by somebody later or, and I, it's an exhausting narrative. And I just like, it makes me wanna just lose the term Pilates instructor entirely and just like, I don't know, make up my own thing or something because, or maybe just call myself a movement instructor because,
Bonnie (11:33.07)
Mm.
Jamie Fearn (11:59.224)
I'm really tired of those debates because they're very polarizing and isolating for people, right? It's like, if I'm doing the true way, then so and so is not. And then what does that mean for them? And it's kind of the same conversation that I had with myself when I was deciding to step away from classical ballet. It's like, um...
Bonnie (12:13.175)
Hmm.
Jamie Fearn (12:25.232)
Did all that work mean nothing if that's not what I'm doing anymore? Or is all of that work because it's not considered successful or I didn't have the success that I was looking for or I didn't reach the milestones that I was expecting? Does that, that can't mean that all of my work didn't mean something. And so I think it's kind of the same within the reins of Pilates or maybe like yoga conversations or really any conversation surrounding movement.
If one person is absolutely right about what they're doing and that is right for everyone, that means a lot of people are doing shit wrong. And that can't be true because there are really smart people out there doing some pretty interesting different things. And we could also get into religion a little bit because I think, actually we shouldn't because then I'd have to see my therapist. But we don't open that can of worms right now. But there is.
Bonnie (13:00.024)
Mm-hmm.
Bonnie (13:20.45)
Hmm
Jamie Fearn (13:21.052)
You know, the same kind of thought I was raised in a very religious sect. And I know we've talked about that before with you as well. And just that idea of like, there are really good people out there. There are really good people out there. And it's really hard to imagine that the good people or the people doing good work, but different work are somehow wrong. I don't know, that's like.
Bonnie (13:35.517)
Hmm.
Bonnie (13:48.079)
I think that's a really good analogy to bring to this because there's absolutely this experience within the yoga world too. And where, you know, neither of us really need to define the things classical versus contemporary. I'm not sure what all of that means, but it's actually not even pertinent for you to be like, and then for me to say like, well, traditional vinyasa or ashtanga or whatever like the things are to wear like creative.
Jamie Fearn (13:55.825)
Okay.
Bonnie (14:13.214)
I don't know. Like, I don't know. There's like so much there is, I think, just in general, we can say there are people that are saying like, this is the only way to do it. And where there's actually a lot of gray space and to bring religion into it and say, you know, for both of us to have grown up in cultures where there was a one right way and where that is very much taught in religious kind of situations of like saying,
That's the way that you are. Everybody will convert to your religion, and that is the goal of the religion. I mean, in Mormonism, it is even that we baptize people after they have died. And that is why there's Mormon temples all around, is like to help people be members of the church, and we do baptisms for the dead.
I mean, I'm not here to like get into like a Mormon doctrine, but that is like a part of it. So it's like truly like, no, we're here for this whole world to be Mormon. And so to release that and say, but there's a lot of other, like, there's a lot of other things here. And for me, I had the same experience where when I left the church eight, nine years ago, people became so beautiful. And
Jamie Fearn (15:31.113)
Mmm.
Bonnie (15:33.034)
I didn't have to do anything. Like I didn't have to change them, I didn't have to influence them, I didn't have to convert them, I didn't have to like, I didn't have to talk to them. I could just like see them and just appreciate them and they were whole without me. And they were doing something different.
Jamie Fearn (15:47.459)
Mm. Yeah, I love that. And I think
I think part of me, regardless of whether we're talking about, you know, my thoughts on religion or my thoughts on movement or whatever, I think part of me has always seen things that way and so there was like a conflict eventually, right? Where I was like, hold on, I think people are really beautiful and saying this takes some of that beauty away from these people.
Bonnie (16:10.125)
Mm-hmm.
Jamie Fearn (16:16.924)
and how do I reconcile that for myself? And I wouldn't say that I've figured much of that out because I like to stuff it down. But I think I'm drawn to movement partly because of how just beautiful I think people are and watching. When you were talking just now, like I got chills because thinking about like my favorite spaces to teach Pilates aren't necessarily.
to be clear, I love my jobs, I love all of them, and I love my studios, but the work that feels the most rewarding to me is like the random little pop-up classes that I'll do at a gym, or I teach a couple of days, or a couple of classes at my gym, and so I'm teaching these classes and I've seen my clients in those classes start at the back.
and they've never done Pilates before and they don't really know what's going on. Does anybody know what's going on? Pilates, we don't really know. But there's like, you know, you can kind of see them back there and then like week after week, they start to move a little closer to the front and they start to pick things up and they start to ask questions. And then because I'm teaching in my neighborhood, I'm seeing them out and about and I'm seeing them in community and I, oh, that is just like, that's what gets me, you know? And that's why I'm like, if I'm feeling burnt out or I'm feeling tired.
Bonnie (17:37.783)
Mm-hmm.
Jamie Fearn (17:41.348)
Moments like that, I'm like, damn, like that's, this is what it, I mean, for me, that's what it has to be all about. And we can go into more of this later, but like I for a while was like, okay, cool. I think I'm a cute person. I've got a good personality. I'm told I'm pretty funny. Like things like that. Maybe I'll use the internet a lot. Maybe I'll use my fitness and make it into content and whatever, but that just...
Bonnie (17:44.858)
Yeah.
Jamie Fearn (18:10.18)
And maybe that'll happen again, who knows, but that just doesn't excite me. Like being in person with people or working with people I know or meeting people and working with them. Like that community, which I think you do an incredible job with all of your work as well as like fostering community. That's what it's all about for me. You know, seeing those people, seeing the little lights turn on, seeing them realize just how powerful they are. It's...
Bonnie (18:12.6)
Mm-hmm.
Bonnie (18:33.568)
Yeah.
Bonnie (18:40.188)
Mm-hmm.
Jamie Fearn (18:40.732)
I mean, I think it's a spiritual experience. And I think, I think we, I think honoring or being a part of that is such an honor because I know how vulnerable it can feel to try new movements or to step into new spaces because I'm afraid of everything. So, you know, I think, I don't know. That is for me what I really, really love.
Bonnie (18:43.863)
Mmm.
Jamie Fearn (19:09.852)
watching and being a part of and doing is like those. By maybe other people's standards, it's like, you know, you're teaching at a gym. That's not some worldwide bloody conglomerate something. It's, but that's the work that I think is just most exciting.
Bonnie (19:25.834)
Yeah. I love that you're bringing in community building as, as part of this. And I think like our story of us meeting is part of that as well. Um, where I hired you to work at a spa here in Portland called Knott Springs. It's a fantastic, beautiful space. And, uh, I was building a team and I took that job because of the team that, because the, to explore what it was like to, to build a team and.
Jamie Fearn (19:41.486)
Mm-hmm. Yes. Yes, ma'am.
Bonnie (19:55.126)
I wanted to build a team that really showed up and really wanted to be there and wanted to be there for each other. And then you moved to town, we were able to be in contact and I was like, oh my gosh, somebody is teaching Pilates and she's cool and she is ready to jump in. You're like so present when you're in the room and you're so committed to what you're doing. And it's interesting because...
You just said it, how you're afraid of everything. And I read on Instagram the other day, like your list, like the things that you're not good at, the things you don't like. And one of them is like trying new things. And it's so funny, because like one of the things I think about you is that you are ready to do that actually. I have known you in the part of your life that I've known you, it has been this expansive place where you have moved to Portland.
Jamie Fearn (20:34.004)
I'm gonna be a good girl.
Bonnie (20:52.358)
And then you took a job and I was like, yes, like come be part of this team, right? And then I remember being in the very first strength training class where you're like picking up weights and then you're like, I don't know what I'm doing. And I'm in the class, I was taking the class with you. And to see that and to see how you're talking about strength now and training people and being certified in that now. And so I see you as somebody who is willing to step into new things.
and then to move and then to be nervous, like now that you're living in Seattle, to be like, now what am I doing? And now to be like thriving. So, or at least from the outside, whatever you're dealing with on the inside. Ha ha ha.
Jamie Fearn (21:32.588)
It's rough out there, but, or in here, in here. Yeah, I've always, I've always been, also to backtrack, the reason that you've thought that I am willing to step up to everything is because you've never taken me skiing, and I'll leave that there. But other than that, I have always been kind of, I've been a very anxious person since I was a little kid. Who knows where it came from?
Bonnie (21:36.095)
Mm-hmm.
Jamie Fearn (21:59.86)
who knows if they'll ever leave. And just because of that anxiety, I think I also, I'm just, you know, kind of inclined to go like the fear route. I feel very afraid of most things. I feel my tummy is a nervous little girl and she does little somersaults anytime I have to try new things. So you kind of have to learn to like deal with it, right? And it's one of those moments where it's like,
Okay, do you want to be limited or do you want to step out? I don't think that there's really anything that I haven't done that I am proud of now that didn't start with me just like wanting to, you know, and jump off a building first. Like I just have always, every, I know at this point in my young life that-
anything worth doing is going to be very scary. And you'd think it'd get easier, but it does not. You know? And I also feel like it kind of like tears up, right? So like, you start with the scary thing, you're like, okay, cool, done. And then the next scary thing is somehow bigger. And then the next scary thing is like something else plus something else. And it's like, it just keeps getting scarier out there. So.
One of my other favorite internet quotes is that the horrors persist, but so do I.
Jamie Fearn (23:33.916)
bringing it all back to internet quotes for you. I don't remember how we got here, but yeah. Yeah, when you hired me, I saw an ad, like a video on TikTok of somebody talking about this space and I was like, cool, maybe I'll go work there. And so I sent an email, I think for a job description that may have still been up but wasn't available anymore.
And so you emailed back and you were like, hey, so that's not a thing anymore. But if you teach Pilates and you wanna come take or come check out the space. And so I met with you and the whole time in my head, like you're thinking, wow, she's so present. Oh, she's so funny. She's so cute. Whatever you were thinking. Those don't have to be the things, but whatever you were thinking. Yeah, perfect. I was thinking, please God, don't let her find out.
Bonnie (24:25.224)
Thanks.
Jamie Fearn (24:33.448)
that I don't know what I'm doing. And that I've only, I think I'd only been teaching Pilates for like, at that point, I was moving from New Orleans where I had taught a little bit, but it was sporadic. I didn't have much on like a full-time schedule. And I had maybe,
Jamie Fearn (24:59.908)
I want to say like a year under my belt. It did not feel like long enough for me. But I also felt like I knew that I had some kind of intuition telling me that I do know how to do this. And I think it comes back to the idea of like movement, it's all the same and also teaching things. It's all the same. It's...
Bonnie (25:27.576)
Mm-hmm.
Jamie Fearn (25:27.976)
How do you show up for other people? How are you being there for those people and giving them tools to succeed? I don't necessarily have to know how to do every single movement in Pilates for myself, but I just have to know how to communicate and troubleshoot and be there for people when they're doing well and also if they're struggling with something. How do we communicate failure? Or how do we communicate like...
Bonnie (25:30.753)
Yeah.
Jamie Fearn (25:56.752)
stick-to-it-iveness or you know things like that. I think when I when we moved to Seattle, we've moved a lot in the last couple years, I was like wow I really have to go and like pick up and start all of this over again and I had my tantrums and I threw my fits and I had my little pity parties and then we got here and I was like all right well let's go and then the first couple weeks in new spaces are really scary.
Bonnie (25:59.839)
Yeah.
Jamie Fearn (26:24.556)
I think for instructors, like people are, even if you think it's not the case, people are probably sizing you up a little bit. People are testing you out. They're seeing who you are, what you're made of, whether it's in a nice way or not. And I had to keep coming back to, you know how to do this. It's relationships. It's community. You know what you're doing. It doesn't matter if you say, you know, something wrong.
or do something wrong, which again, remember, I hate that. I hate being wrong. I hate doing things wrong. Yeah, and it all comes back to, I would get into sessions and I would be like, okay, this person is like a high profile person, or they have a lot of issues going on in their body, and I would be so nervous, and then I would have to just be like, build a relationship. That's all you're doing, you know?
Bonnie (27:18.358)
Hmm
Bonnie (27:23.77)
I love that so much. I think because one of the things I tell people in flow school and the teachers, when I'm talking to teachers, I'm like, okay, there's so many things to think about when you're with people, if you're with a class or even if you're a one-on-one, like those are very different energies you're holding, but there's a lot of things still that you're holding. There's way more than one thing that you're holding and you can get in your head about your ability to meet these people. And so I always say,
you're gonna help them move and breathe and rest. That's all you're doing. That's all you have to do.
Jamie Fearn (27:58.096)
And doesn't that just like give me chills? Like the most peaceful moments of my life are the moments again, where I've felt rest or I've just felt in my body or I've felt connected to nature or people or whatever. And like, we do that. Like we give people the tools for that. And that I think is, that's again, it comes back to like, that's all I really give a shit about. I don't.
Bonnie (28:24.782)
Right. But I think though that your, your statement of you're here to build a relationship simplifies that down in another and kind of gives it a different slant too is saying like, we're just here to help you move and breathe and rest. So like, that's like kind of what we're trying to give, but we're just here to build a relationship. And I think that any movement instructor could probably fall into like the category of I have to give this client or this class.
all of the things where in reality you don't and you cannot. And it actually will probably not be very appropriate. It'll be too overwhelming that person, those people might not come back because now you have given them more than what they are asking for or what they're definitely not wanting. And so, and really trusting the process of it instead. And so I love the idea of, we're just here to build a relationship.
where in this relationship, we're going to move and breathe and rest and we're going to be with each other. And it makes it so simple and it removes any sort of pedestal experience where you, I'm not, I'm not here to be on a pedestal. The only way they're like, the only direction there is down. Like don't put me there. I'm here with you and we're here to build a relationship. Like I love, I love using that. I'm going to use that phrase now. That's great.
Jamie Fearn (29:27.272)
Mm, yeah.
Jamie Fearn (29:35.537)
Mm-hmm.
Jamie Fearn (29:50.02)
Well, it is trademarked. No, I'm just kidding. Um, I gotta go to it. File trademark. Just kidding. Um, yeah, I... I think it's the only way... I have a lot of, like, I don't know if we'd call them hacks or, like, I don't know, psychotic tendencies, but on how to, like, make myself less nervous because I'm a nervous girl. Yeah.
Bonnie (30:13.698)
Hmm. Yeah. Tell us.
Jamie Fearn (30:16.584)
one of them is to like simplify things down so that it doesn't seem like a big scary thing and so for me one of the only ways to do that when I'm I mean I still get nervous teaching I'll be honest like I'm I've been teaching movement since I was like 17 I was teaching ballet classes 29 I think yeah I'm in my 30th year or coming up on my 30th year um so
Bonnie (30:37.014)
And how old are you now?
Jamie Fearn (30:46.272)
I can't do math, but I'm sure someone listening can, so you figure that out. Now you know how long I've been teaching movement. When you find that out, send me an email so that I know, because I'm not going back and I'm not doing math. I can't. I can count to eight and I can count to ten. I can't really count down from ten, but I can count down from eight.
Bonnie (31:08.299)
Perfect. Check.
Jamie Fearn (31:09.668)
I like to cut eight and a half and use four pretty often. Sometimes I'll cut 10 and a half and I think that's still five, right? And then other than that, it's a mystery. Thank God there are no fractions in this world of movement because...
Bonnie (31:26.003)
I mean, have you done bicep curls where you've only listed up halfway and then go back down and then folds? Right? Now you know.
Jamie Fearn (31:31.924)
Yeah, you're right. Okay. But I guess I would say like even when I'm lifting weights, like if I'm loading up a barbell at any point, I could be I could be lifting way more than I know because I'm like, okay, so if you add these two together, plus this one plus the bar, most of the time, I think I know what I'm doing. Sometimes, maybe it's more. I don't know.
Bonnie (31:54.01)
Yeah, I'm always math-ing in the garage. I'm like, okay, wait now, this plus this plus this. Okay, now, okay, okay. Some multiplication, some addition.
Jamie Fearn (31:59.796)
And then there's also, yeah, you can take some plates off and then put other plates on and those plates will make a different number. I don't get it. It seems really high tech. And that's, I don't remember where it's, oh, how long I've been teaching. So I've been teaching, yeah, for however many years. And
Bonnie (32:07.918)
Right, right.
Bonnie (32:24.246)
and you still get nervous.
Jamie Fearn (32:24.488)
I don't. I still get nervous. Yeah, and I remember like the first couple times I taught ballet classes to younger kids. I was nervous, but I also am the oldest sister of... Five other siblings. Yeah, so there are six of us and I'm the oldest sister and I have an older brother. So I know how to be bossy. I know how to tell. Like ask me sisters. They will tell you.
your girl's a bossy bitch. But yeah, so I know how to do that. But like, I've taught a lot of things and I've been teaching for a while and I know how to command a room, I know how to teach. And I still, I would say every week I have at least one class where I feel a little nervous about something, whether it's a person that I don't have the vibe yet, or if it's a person that comes in and they're new and I can tell they're having a hard time. Like I feel physically nervous.
wanting to make sure that the class is accessible or the class is, for some people, I want to make sure it's challenging because I can see when they walk in they're like, yeah, I'm here to take Pilates, I know it's going to be so easy. So then I'm like, yeah, bet, let's see about that. So, you know, I, I have not really mastered the art of not being nervous about things. But I also think that if you're nervous about things, you care about things, right? So.
Bonnie (33:28.056)
Mm-hmm.
Bonnie (33:48.022)
Mm.
Jamie Fearn (33:50.36)
If I have to live with a little discomfort, I suppose I can. Um, but yeah, I... Yeah. I think...
Bonnie (34:00.078)
I love that. If you're nervous about things, you care about things.
Jamie Fearn (34:03.088)
I think that's, it has to be, I need it to be true.
Bonnie (34:05.046)
Yeah. Well, I would say even so I'm in my current 13th round of flow school. And in August, it'll be four years that I've been leading it. So.
Jamie Fearn (34:13.512)
Did you do the math for that before you got on? So you had it earlier.
Bonnie (34:16.314)
I just do, no, I call it 13 like the whole time. So I know I don't have to math or like go backwards. I'm like, this is just number 13.
Jamie Fearn (34:23.058)
It's the night. Drop. Yeah. Oh, you're saying after this I should go figure out how many years it is and then just add one every year. I have an idea.
Bonnie (34:31.536)
Well, it's not every year. I mean, I do more than one a year. So in this August, I will have been guiding close school for four years. But I will, which feels like a good chunk of, I'm like four years I've been doing that. That's...
Jamie Fearn (34:34.652)
that's right.
Jamie Fearn (34:39.633)
Oh.
Jamie Fearn (34:45.203)
I'd take that out of college or high school experience. That's like a whole, a whole.
Bonnie (34:48.41)
Right? That's a lot of times. And I feel like even just now I'm just, I am thinking, oh, I know what I'm doing. I know what I'm doing. I know exactly where we need to go. We actually might need a little bit more time here now. And this is really what's gonna help people be successful. It's so fun. It's so fun to be with something for a longer time and to watch how.
and to keep asking the questions of how to do it better. And I walk away from every time being like, okay, this is the time. But I, the beginning of every flow school, and I'm reading people's responses of what they're excited about or what they're hoping to get from it. And I just sit with it and I feel the whelm. I don't know if I wanna call it overwhelmed, but I just feel the whelm of having to deliver and of showing up for people and...
Jamie Fearn (35:42.932)
Thanks for watching!
Bonnie (35:43.882)
I mean, in classes, yes, there can be those moments too, but I'm gonna speak to full school since that's kind of front and center of my brain. And tomorrow I leave for another in-person round. And just understanding the impact it is as a guide and as a teacher for showing up with other people who are ready to learn and in any capacity, in any situation, like it is significant. Like there is something that's...
there's a space that we have to occupy as teachers. And I feel that and there's a nervousness in that. I'm like, okay, but, okay, we're gonna do the thing. And so I, and I'm like, okay, how can I channel this? Like you can't let it freeze you, right? And I think it can freeze us if we live in the fear of what I might not be able to do or what I might do, or whatever the, if we think there's a wrongness. And I,
I was talking to somebody about, you know, they're like, well, what if, what if people keep showing up? Cause they are just interested in like this persona that I'm putting on and then it feels exhausting to keep that up. I'm like, oh, well yeah, that's exactly why you don't put on a persona. Like that's why you just show up and be your real damn self because that's all you can be.
Jamie Fearn (36:57.372)
Yeah.
Jamie Fearn (37:03.836)
Yeah. And there's that responsibility there, you know? Like, I don't take my job lightly. I think in the fitness and movement realm, I mean, my partner's job is in the medical field and I hang out with and know a lot of people that work these big...
corporate jobs and like, you know, they also hate them, but that's not the point.
Jamie Fearn (37:37.308)
And I often compare myself to people like that, but I think also, you know, when we're going around the room and we're saying what we do, because people are so obsessed with what we do for work. I'll be like, I'm a fitness instructor, or I'm a Pilates instructor, whatever. And you know, sometimes people will be like, oh, that's, you can kind of, you get the vibe that they're thinking like, that's cute. Like that's, you know, that must be nice to make your own schedule or something like that. But like, let me be clear.
This job is very challenging and I take it very seriously and the amount of
vulnerability that people are coming to me with like that Don't I and I also get very protective over my people over my clients right like you don't fuck with my clients if One of my clients goes to a different studio and comes back and they had a bad experience Or they somebody said something to them. I'm like, alright, well tell me where those people live and you will never hear from them again like This is a serious job. This is hard work. This is
And we don't need to talk about equity of certain jobs and whatnot, but in a place where this can often be looked at as a service type industry, because it is, but.
Jamie Fearn (38:59.62)
I just, I take it very seriously and I always, I don't take the vulnerability that people are coming to me with lightly and so there is that responsibility of like, we do have to deliver, you know, and depending on how much you're teaching per week, like you're delivering how many hours you're teaching and that's a lot of work and that's a lot of energy and a lot of space and I also
you mentioned something about, you know, that sometimes that can bring a lot of weight to you as an instructor, to me as an instructor, and I heard someone the other day told me, I think it was in regards to maybe theater or something like that. They were talking about, I think they were an actor in theater or something like that, and they were saying that one of the biggest ways that, or one of the biggest
Phrases that helped them with I think stage fright or something which I feel like we get as instructors Was that they remind themselves that the people there to see the play or whatever and our clay paste the class They want to enjoy it They're there to enjoy it. They're not there to pick you apart I mean there might be some but there aren't that many and if they are fuck them but like
Bonnie (40:12.002)
Hmm.
Jamie Fearn (40:20.94)
they want to enjoy it. They're there for 50 minutes or 60 minutes or whatever to enjoy themselves, to feel their bodies. It's not really about us. We're teaching the class, but it's about them. And so again, I think, you know, it can be scary. It can be nerve wracking and it can be a lot. But when you take yourself out of it and you realize, like you said, taking yourself off of the pedestal, like, I mean,
Bonnie (40:31.932)
Mm-hmm.
Jamie Fearn (40:48.408)
If there was ever anyone in the world that wanted to be famous, I'll be honest, it's me. Like, you know, can we just say that? Can we be honest? I have always, I love when people tell me I'm funny. That's like, if you want to make me happy, tell me I'm funny. Laugh at my jokes. If someone's going to laugh at my jokes, I'm going to be friends with them. They could be like, you know, that's, that's my criteria is pretty low. I just need you to laugh at my jokes. And like, um,
Bonnie (40:59.63)
I'm out.
Bonnie (41:06.602)
Perfect.
Jamie Fearn (41:17.296)
It could be very easy to take this job and be like, like I mentioned earlier with, you know, thinking for a moment, maybe I'll go like the influencer route. And then you get into it and you're just like, but wait, it's not about me. And they're definitely incredible. Like I've really admire the way that you run your social media because it's very clear that you're holding space, you're providing a container, but it's not, you know, it's not all about Bonnie. It's about the community we build and we build.
community together and the relationships and yeah, I just, that's, you know, it's easy to become really concerned with how you are being perceived or putting yourself out there but at the end of the day, like, it's really not about you.
Bonnie (42:06.83)
Mm, yeah, yeah. I appreciate all this. And I think in this conversation too of online and call it influencer, I mean, we're all influencers of something. We're all gonna. And you know, I guess I don't even, I don't really spend a lot of time thinking like, okay, am I a quote unquote, do I fall in the influencer category? I think when I think influencer personally in my brain, I think of,
Jamie Fearn (42:21.716)
Thanks for watching!
Bonnie (42:36.238)
people who are always having deals with other brands, who are getting a kickback from brands and are having partnerships in that way. And in that way, I'm not, I don't have any of that, but I definitely am on social media with people who are listening and have an influence over because I am doing something. So then in that way, then I'm like, well, sure. And also, we all...
Jamie Fearn (42:40.314)
Mm-hmm.
Jamie Fearn (42:55.548)
Yeah, absolutely.
Bonnie (43:03.342)
fall into that category that we just have. Yeah. It's, yeah.
Jamie Fearn (43:05.556)
It's true, yeah, it's definitely true. I think that I have started to notice that in myself. And so I do, I feel like it's very like, all the cool people are like hating on social media these days and they're like, oh, it's so bad for us. And I'm sure it is, but there are a lot of things that are bad for us.
I love social media. I happen to think like it's hilarious. I love like the I mean I I'm the kind of person that will be like watching videos and like laughing at them out loud because I just I love the creativity of people and I love many aspects of social media and so I've just decided that for myself with my I Think it's like 1200 followers, you know, just little guys, but like those are my people And I'm gonna speak to them
Bonnie (43:43.617)
Yeah.
Bonnie (43:56.962)
Mm-hmm.
Jamie Fearn (43:58.741)
And I don't.
I say this and it sounds kind of like I'm like using reverse psychology, but like I don't care if it grows. Because the people that I've added, especially recently, I'm not going to say that I know all 1200 of them. I wish I did. But the people I've added, especially recently, I've had conversations with. I've met in person or we've had conversations over Instagram and they're like, Hey, we love what you're doing. Or
Bonnie (44:07.982)
Mm-hmm.
Jamie Fearn (44:29.828)
hey, this meant a lot or the people that I'll post something and I'll forget that I posted it and people will message me and be like, this really spoke to me or like I had made that post a couple months. No, a couple weeks ago, maybe like a week ago, not long ago about how I've always been insecure about my arms and how with strength training, my arms have grown and that would have spent sent me into a spiral.
probably even a year ago, the fact that like my arm mass has grown and you see people with toned arms and that's cool for them. Mine, when they're pressed against my body, they just look like arms that are bigger than they were before. And I had so many women saying like, I have spent my entire life being so self-conscious about my arms. And you read that.
Bonnie (45:19.266)
Hmm.
Jamie Fearn (45:25.252)
I'm getting a tiny bit emotional. You read that and you realize like, we spend so much time suffering alone, you know? And everything's fine. It's all under control. Yeah, getting a little bit emotional over here.
Jamie Fearn (45:51.376)
Yeah, lots of women saying, I've felt so self-conscious about my arms or I have hated this part of my body for so long. And being able to be like, hey, I'm there with you. And I don't have it all figured out because Lord knows, I pull myself apart quite often still. I try to put out this persona that I'm very confident and I do think I am very, I'm much more confident than I used to be in myself, but I still have those days where I look at myself in the mirror and I'm like.
Bonnie (46:00.93)
Hmm.
Jamie Fearn (46:21.12)
Well, that's not what I wanted, you know?
Jamie Fearn (46:27.008)
I could go into so much about that because I think that especially as women, and especially having been involved in a very religious community, we're kind of hardwired to feel pretty shitty about ourselves because we're picked apart from, you know, before puberty, essentially.
But all that to say, we're not alone in our suffering. It takes it all back to community, which I guess is our reoccurring theme here. But yeah, like I don't have a huge following, but the people that I have mean a lot to me. Those people are real people I'm involved with and that's important to me, so maybe it doesn't need to grow that much. Or maybe it grows really slowly. I went to a fashion event.
Bonnie (46:59.999)
Mm.
Bonnie (47:13.486)
Mm-hmm.
Jamie Fearn (47:17.988)
a couple of weekends ago and I met so many cool people there and we all follow each other now but now I can be like I know that person, I met that person and every single like hot pic that the girls are posting we're coming in and we're commenting like oh my god you look amazing or like you know internet speak the lingo and it's fun and it's like that feels good that feels good to me and that feels like what social media is supposed to be or what I want to be you know.
Bonnie (47:34.402)
Mm-hmm.
Bonnie (47:47.588)
Yeah. Oof. Oh. I just have to breathe with that for a moment. I have to breathe with that for a second. Mm.
Jamie Fearn (47:52.724)
Anyway, let's take a break. Yeah. Um, going back to influencers, if I could be an influencer of anything, it would be mustard.
Bonnie (48:01.634)
Hmm. Yeah.
Jamie Fearn (48:04.312)
I want to be sponsored by a mustard company. I fucking love mustard. We're gonna get a photo. Yeah, ideally if it could be a stone ground or whole grain mustard, I'd be very happy. I would take any mustard because we could do like a fun collaboration with hot dogs which I also love.
Bonnie (48:10.792)
There you have it. Buster Companies, reach out to Jamie Fern. Ha ha ha.
Bonnie (48:22.26)
Okay, okay.
Bonnie (48:29.123)
because you have a wiener dog.
Jamie Fearn (48:30.524)
Cause I have a wiener dog and I'm sorry, I love a good hot dog. I don't know who to talk to about that. I don't know. Judge me all you want. Yeah. We love a good wiener. This is a wiener family. This is a wiener zone. Can I show you guys my wiener paraphernalia? I mean you can't see it cause it's a pod call. Yeah. So this is a weenie dog. You can hear it kind of stretching maybe. Maybe not, I don't know. It's just, it's filled with like beans. That's not helpful. It's...
Bonnie (48:34.79)
I mean, there's some good wieners out there, so.
Bonnie (48:46.515)
over on the podcast. Describe it for anybody who's listening.
Bonnie (48:54.647)
Mm-hmm.
Bonnie (49:00.494)
It's like a sand. Mm-hmm.
Jamie Fearn (49:01.68)
It's got sand in it and it's squishy and it stretches. It's like a stress wiener. So I do think.
Bonnie (49:09.193)
So when you're feeling, again, if you're feeling anxiety or stress, just get a wiener.
Jamie Fearn (49:11.964)
Yes. And humping's not an option. Yes. When you grab this little stress wiener and you just kind of squeeze, hold it and you pull it and you do whatever you need to do. I also have wiener dog paperclips. If you can't see them, I don't know. Think of a paperclip shaped as a wiener dog. I mean, you can't see them. You're listening to me. And then I have a, it looks like it's made out of like cast iron, but I'm sure it's like plastic painted well.
Bonnie (49:18.706)
You just hold it.
Jamie Fearn (49:42.556)
You know, it's got like a nice little knock to it though, but it's another wiener dog. I married into a wiener dog cult. So that's what happened there.
Bonnie (49:43.189)
Yes.
Bonnie (49:52.558)
Fantastic. Well, this combination of wieners, stone ground mustard. I love that. You're like, yeah, I have a fitness account. I talk fashion and I am a mustard influencer.
Jamie Fearn (49:57.843)
Yeah.
Jamie Fearn (50:05.468)
I mean, I'm just being real. I don't really care about, I mean, I would also take sponsorships from active wear brands, but I also don't really want to, this is gonna sound, this is gonna, I'm gonna be, no one's ever gonna want me after this, but I don't really want to influence people to buy active wear. I like what I like, but I'm not gonna tell you it's better than what you like, which is why I realized very quickly I'm not cut out to be.
Bonnie (50:26.154)
Mm.
Bonnie (50:33.579)
Yeah.
Jamie Fearn (50:33.884)
that kind of influencer because I don't like people telling me what to do. So I'm probably not going to tell, I had tell people, other people what to do. I had like one affiliate program that I got and it was with a protein powder company or something and then I would, I think I posted like three times and I was like, but if you have other protein powders that you love, don't listen, don't listen to me. Like
Why are you listening to me? What do I know? I know what I like, but I also love mustard. So, if you don't like mustard, we're probably not gonna get along. I think this is vinegar.
Bonnie (51:05.386)
Yeah.
Bonnie (51:12.558)
You know, I have I have grown in my like of mustard I really was like a mustard hater But I a little bit I can do a little bit of mustard Yeah
Jamie Fearn (51:16.076)
Here's the thing, I have to, exactly. She comes out of nowhere. Oh, just a little bit, okay. I have been known, this is disgusting. If you're listening and you're mustard squeamish, pause now and then you can fast forward, but I eat mustard with a spoon. Bye.
Bonnie (51:33.814)
Wow, okay, yeah, I mean, there's that too.
Jamie Fearn (51:38.788)
Yeah, I mean, I'm about it. I think it's the vinegar because I also love pickles. But I hate the smell of regular by itself vinegar. So I don't know how that works.
Bonnie (51:41.538)
Yeah.
Bonnie (51:45.451)
Yeah, I like pickles.
Bonnie (51:52.65)
I don't know either, but I will keep my eyes open. If I see anything about mustard, I will send it your way. You be prepared for all mustard memes.
Jamie Fearn (51:57.808)
Another idea? Yeah, no, absolutely. I mean, that's, you know, I'm here for community and I'm here for mustard. I feel like mustard brings people together, or apart, but also together.
Bonnie (52:12.306)
Oh my gosh. OK. I want to jump back to your 1,200 people that you're going to be selling mustard to. No, that we're selling mustard to people. I'm going to talk about your audience that you're going to talk about mustard. And I really hope you do have, like, I think you should make a whole reel about mustard. Like, make a video. Like, this is like, I would like this to be a mustard count. But in the way of, I want to talk about it because you and I have talked.
Jamie Fearn (52:17.129)
You don't want to tell me. This is not a big surprise. That's your thought process? Oh, OK.
Jamie Fearn (52:26.036)
Oh, perfect.
Jamie Fearn (52:30.608)
this mustard. I mean.
Bonnie (52:41.182)
in the past about perhaps you building something online, if that's something interesting to you. I love talking to people and helping people build whatever it is they want to build. I do have some experience in the online space. I don't own a brick and mortar. I have run teams. And so I can help people in these different sorts of ways. But this idea of building a relationship, which is what you're kind of thinking about as you go into situations with other people. And
also how it's not about you. And at the same time, if you if we were to look at our personal social media pages, we are the ones that are like it's our face. Right. So it's like an interesting sort of combination where my page is Bonnie Weeks. Bonnie Weeks is my page. So like that's, it's going to be me, it's going to be me talking and being there. Carrot bowl Bonnie, right.
Jamie Fearn (53:22.793)
Mm-hmm.
Jamie Fearn (53:36.641)
actually carrot bowl Bonnie.
Bonnie (53:41.274)
True story. And yours is currently Jamie.
Jamie Fearn (53:44.668)
Jamie G. Ratt.
Bonnie (53:50.927)
I love the wrap.
Jamie Fearn (53:51.46)
Now I'm thinking about changing it just now to something with mustard
Bonnie (53:56.382)
You should probably just... Yeah, mustard rats? I don't know.
Jamie Fearn (53:59.924)
That's scary. I don't know if I like that.
Bonnie (54:03.454)
But I think this idea that you're speaking to the people that are there, and that's really, that so falls right in line with how I've always thought of my social media account. So I'm like, sure, it will probably grow. If you, if anybody is going to show up and do the work of creativity and attention and building community and conversation and like continuing to post, like you're going to grow.
maybe that's one a day, maybe that's one a week, maybe that's one a month, person a month, but it's like you are because you are literally just showing up and somebody is going to resonate with your voice and what you're sharing and how you're sharing it. Maybe if your account's private and you're just posting pictures of your kids, then that's probably going to be a different story. So I'm talking very specifically around trying to serve a public audience, but something that I've always thought about is I'm like, I want to talk to the people who are there.
Jamie Fearn (54:40.974)
Mm-hmm.
Bonnie (54:59.582)
It's kind of ridiculous to think about talking to the people who aren't there because they aren't there. Like what are the people that you're currently working with? How do you actually show up and serve them? And really it is about relationship building. And I think it's interesting to have you bring this idea of, you know, if we were to go to a play, then we're not there.
to go see how terrible it is. We're there to go, like to be entertained and to enjoy ourselves, to have a night out, to have an experience and to compare that to going to a class where people are coming to be entertained truly in a sort of way to not have to make all the decisions. They're just gonna have to show up there and be there with their body and whatever, like sit in the seat, lay on the mat, be on this machine, whatever it is, they're gonna be like, okay, cool. If like you come.
Like, I'm gonna show up, I'm gonna pay you to have this experience where, you know, really leaning into the trust that people are actually trusting that they're gonna have an experience and they're not there to pick it apart. Yes, that we're gonna get feedback and yes, we have places to grow in all of our teaching and it will be a journey, but I think people really are showing up just wanting an experience and so trying to hold ourselves in that, right?
is I think important, but also as like a social media kind of conversation and kind of the love fest we're having for a moment for social media is that it is a stage. And thinking of our pages, you can post, Jamie, you could post 20 times today if you want it. Post, not just stories.
Jamie Fearn (56:52.084)
It's gonna be a long time. At least.
Bonnie (56:55.146)
Right, you could post 20 posts a day. You could share 100 stories. You could eat mustard on hot dogs for 15 of those. Right, just like this idea that it's such an open space of creativity and of permission that only you have to give yourself. Nobody else is waiting to give you permission.
Jamie Fearn (57:06.084)
last year. Good idea.
Jamie Fearn (57:18.173)
Mm-hmm.
Bonnie (57:23.274)
Like you literally can take it and use it and connect with it and create with it. And it's as big as the world. And there's no, like how creative do you wanna be here? And I think that's what's really exciting to think of rather than trying to prove anything. Say like, how do I show up? How do I be myself? It's exhausting to not be yourself. And how do I show up with other people and connect?
And then it gets really fun.
Jamie Fearn (57:53.148)
Yeah. And that's I think some of my most successful moments on social media have been like that. Because you do get caught up in the like there's, if you're familiar with like fitness content and fitness creators and influencers, it's all kind of the same shit repackaged. And it makes me really tired.
Bonnie (58:16.94)
Yeah, so.
Jamie Fearn (58:19.076)
And so I know for sure that that's not something I wanna be part of. And so it's figuring out, I've had a lot of iterations of myself online and I think they're just slowly becoming more and more me. And now I have like, I did probably a good year or so where I really only talked much about fitness online and people thought I lived at the gym and I was like, well, that's not what I want because I don't and I also love.
wearing really cool clothes. I love the power of clothing and fashion and I've always been interested in fashion. Even as a small child growing up on a little farm, I have just always loved it. I used to draw outfits all the time. I used to, going back to being in like the religious community, I used to...
I had brands that I named myself and all of these brands had modesty guidelines where I would talk about the appropriate measures for each brand and different brands had different modesty levels. So if you were really modest, you could go with brand A and then all the way up to like a shirt that maybe had a V neck in it. And that would be, you know, I wouldn't have used.
Bonnie (59:31.557)
That was the most scandalous.
Jamie Fearn (59:33.02)
like yeah, that was like the slutty one. And anyway, so I loved fashion. And then I feel like I cut part of that off a little bit when I had to like go make a living, right? Cause that's, I wasn't going to a fashion school. I didn't have the money for that. So like in my head, I was like, well, I guess that doesn't really matter, right? I don't need that. That's not gonna, it's not gonna make me money. So cut part of that off and through.
coming back to Seattle and going to some fun fashion events with some people that I've met in the area here who love clothing, it's kind of rekindled this idea that like, that's part of me that's important and that's gonna fit in somehow and I don't really know how yet, but like it's really fucking fun to get dressed up and to go somewhere and just, you know you look good, like you know, we all have that one outfit.
We all have that one outfit. And if you don't have that outfit, call me and I will help you find it. My phone number, no, I'm just kidding. But I'm serious about that. If you get emails, you send them right over to me. I will give them two things, mustard advice, and I will give them, we will go shopping. But we all have that outfit that makes us feel just hella confident and we feel good. And when you feel good, you're like, I don't even.
Bonnie (01:00:55.863)
Mmm.
Jamie Fearn (01:00:59.092)
I don't even know how to describe that, but like when you feel good and you feel like you're like yourself in that, that's really powerful. And that's what I love about clothes is that when I feel
Bonnie (01:01:06.678)
Mm-hmm.
Jamie Fearn (01:01:13.808)
When I love what I'm wearing, I just feel like so invincible. I feel like I'm like, I feel like people are looking and people are paying attention and that's all we want, right, that's what we want. We want people to pay attention, not even in a vain way. We just want people to see us there. We want people to see us and experience us and I love fashion for that reason. And I'm sure they all, all my things go hand in hand somehow. I don't know what they are. I also kind of want to be a firefighter. I haven't figured out how that fits in yet.
Bonnie (01:01:18.294)
Hmm.
Bonnie (01:01:28.492)
Yeah.
Bonnie (01:01:35.778)
Hmm.
Jamie Fearn (01:01:45.188)
I'm also scared of fire, so... We'll figure that out! Right.
Bonnie (01:01:48.634)
That's a little tricky one. I love this conversation of fashion and of the desire to be seen. I think all of us are trying to belong. I think all of us wanna be seen. I think it can be a really scary thing. As part of the scary thing about being a teacher is because you are seen and because it's then vulnerable because you're at the front of the room and all of a sudden you're in that experience and maybe you didn't know that was gonna be part of it. But at the same time, even then.
We all want to be seen. We all want to feel like we belong, like we're important to somebody that we're wanted. And so this idea of connecting fashion and of not just wearing the clothes, but embodying the clothes, being like, oh, this is a hell yes. Like, I am feeling myself in this. And, and I mean,
Jamie Fearn (01:02:19.732)
Mm-hmm.
Jamie Fearn (01:02:39.74)
Yeah, yeah, it's powerful.
Bonnie (01:02:44.098)
There's times in our lives that maybe we haven't found that thing, right? And maybe we haven't made the time for it. Maybe we're not being seen or maybe it's not being reflected to us. Or maybe we're like, because we, I don't know, Jamie, don't you think like there's like part of it that is actually, here's what I want to say. I think one of the important things that you said was that you said, you know, know that you have that one outfit. That actually starts.
Jamie Fearn (01:03:12.294)
Mm-hmm.
Bonnie (01:03:13.846)
with you, like you are like, oh, I have the outfit that I feel hella bombin'. Right. But then it's be, then you go out in it and then you're like, oh, people come in, see me, see me here today. Like I see me, you, I want you to see me too, because I am seeing me. I want, and it becomes like this mirror kind of experience then to be seen. But I, an important piece of it though, I think is that you are being willing to see yourself.
Jamie Fearn (01:03:15.39)
Mm-hmm.
Jamie Fearn (01:03:18.956)
I know, I know. All of this. And it's also...
Jamie Fearn (01:03:43.936)
Mm. Yeah. Well, dang. I didn't even think about that one. Well, that's not true. I, that, yeah, definitely. I can see that, and I think, it, even going back to like strength training.
and starting to allow my body to exist larger than it used to be, right? I, again, as a ex-classical ballerina, gaining weight is like a death sentence, and it sounds dramatic, but it is that serious in your mind, and... you know, that... the idea alone that I could be wearing clothes that I still feel incredibly confident in...
knowing that like my
Jamie Fearn (01:04:38.344)
Feeling that my body is growing and being okay with that and letting that happen and realizing that When you grow you take up more space right whether that's physical or just or mental or both It goes hand-in-hand with wearing clothes that make you mimic that feeling for you of like I see
that this is fucking awesome, I see this outfit, now you get to see this outfit too, lucky you. And that is, I mean, that's still a vulnerable place to be, right? Like this last event, I wore an all white outfit, blue shoes, and a gold chain and a pearl necklace. And you can paint however you want to, like pretend, you know, make up your mind. It did look pretty good, but that's bold choice.
Bonnie (01:05:29.122)
Fucking hot, fucking hot. Yeah.
Jamie Fearn (01:05:36.56)
You know, but that's something that felt so authentically me. I wore it and it's like, I felt good. I saw myself, I knew the moment I put it on, I was like, this is it. And then I went out and I was like, guys, this is it. And everyone was like, that's really it, you know? And it's that, again, community of recognizing each other, seeing each other.
Bonnie (01:05:53.73)
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Bonnie (01:06:02.27)
Yeah, but I, gosh, like this is, like this is, this is it, like this is the conversation.
Jamie Fearn (01:06:02.512)
And we're back, community.
Bonnie (01:06:11.894)
Like the belly of this moment right here in this conversation, this is exactly, I think, the gold of what we're trying to get to in ourselves, in our service to others, is this desire to see ourselves and to give ourselves permission to get bigger and to take up more space. And that looks like so many different things. We are more than one thing, and it is the...
Jamie Fearn (01:06:18.854)
Mm.
Bonnie (01:06:40.598)
the stitching together of all those things and saying they all can exist here. And we will take the things that have been or past the things that have been tricky and we will look at those in the face and we say, okay, you're here too, I will befriend you, come along for the ride, you're in it. And where I love, you know, I watched you post about your arms and then you shared about the people's experience and then to share here about this and your own growth of your arms and of your physical body because you can't...
go from not strength training to strength training and not, and have that be a consistent practice and not have growth happen. You are. And so your body literally will take up a different type of space. That doesn't even mean people's weight will change. Your weight could totally stay the same way, but your body is gonna change and your weight might also change. But you're, yeah, because muscle weighs more.
Jamie Fearn (01:07:16.65)
you're going to grow.
Jamie Fearn (01:07:32.399)
and we're okay with it.
Jamie Fearn (01:07:36.592)
Yeah, and like I also probably could have, you know, stand or stood to gain a few pounds anyway, but yeah, like I started again, like really consistently showing up to the gym or showing up in my strength training about a year ago. And that was, I had to make a decision. It happens slowly, right? Like if you're doing it,
consistently but not like insanely, you're going to grow but it's going to be slow, right? And then as you're growing, you're starting to notice that maybe your pants don't fit the way they used to. And maybe that's a good thing. Maybe your butt's looking juicy, but also as a woman, I think especially, like we're not supposed to, we don't think we're supposed to go up pants sizes or we're supposed to exist as a certain size forever or, and in a...
This sounds maybe a little dramatic, but in one way, I feel like that gaining, becoming more of yourself, whether it's through strength training, gaining more physical weight, or even just gaining physical weight and allowing your body to exist as it is, and not giving yourself these strict guidelines, you're doing the work of like...
of like smashing down these systems of oppression, you know? Like, especially as women, we've been conditioned to believe there's only one way for your body to look, or there's only one way for you to exist, or you have to be quiet, or you have to, and maybe part of that is again, coming from that religious background, but allowing yourself to exist, allowing yourself to take up more space, physical, mental, whatever, you're doing the work to like, I mean, it's brave work.
and you're doing the work to step outside of these systems that can hold you back. Can really hold you back. And it's powerful work. So people see gaining weight or putting on an outfit that is a different size or whatever is maybe something that's not as big of a deal. But for me, that's a big deal. And I think for a lot of women, we know that's a big deal. You're doing. If you're...
Bonnie (01:09:33.859)
Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Bonnie (01:09:52.695)
Mm-hmm.
Jamie Fearn (01:09:55.012)
Allowing yourself to exist as more of a version a true version of yourself is that that's real work. That's bravery. That's that's big work because There's a lot of there are a lot of rules that were told or were told there are a lot of rules and
Bonnie (01:10:02.198)
Yeah.
Bonnie (01:10:05.899)
Yeah.
Bonnie (01:10:13.322)
Well, I think the whole idea of just taking up space, like that could be, lines could be drawn a lot of ways of, don't take up too much space here, or like who needs to be served here and not me. And so it's a decentering of self. And I think people who fall into being parents, then, you know, who are like choose, choose or become by circumstances become parents. And where self goes in that, and as women and as socialized women,
And there's so many ways that perhaps the story has been an example, like exemplified to us as this is the way to exist and to keep yourself in a small space. And we can feel it in ourselves when we start to pay attention. Like this is part of the practice of paying attention is feeling when you are keeping yourself small or paying attention to the...
the rooms that you're in that feel like they're trying to keep you small. And there is not the encouragement of expansion and of growth. And if that is a room you are in to start saying, why do I feel trapped? Why do I feel stuck? How can I change, not just me, like first of all, I wanna say like, how can you change the room that you're in so that there's a little bit more wiggle room and then.
So you even have space to look at you and be like, am I now at the same time trying to trap myself inside myself and the permission we can help give each other. I think this is why as instructors, when we show up and be our weirdest self, we're like, we're gonna be here as human because we're trying to create a room where you have some freedom to find out what that means for you. And it's fucking bold to say, I'm gonna be a little bit bigger here.
I'm going to let my body take up literal like space in here and actually keep doing that. Not just like stay here, but I'm going to keep on. And then I'm going to talk about it. Then I'm going to help you figure out how you can take up, your body can take up more space. And then this idea of clothing and of adorning ourselves. And I love all this conversation about clothing because for me,
Bonnie (01:12:33.242)
Right now I have on this black and white striped shirt with these gold buttons and I have pink pants on. On top of this, I've decided that this year 2024 is my color and pattern year.
Jamie Fearn (01:12:40.212)
What the?
Jamie Fearn (01:12:47.56)
I like that. And you did both of those things. You have a quarter, you have a quarter.
Bonnie (01:12:50.218)
Yeah, right. But like, I feel quite often like I'm going out in public and I am very colorful or I'm mixing different sorts of patterns in weird ways. I'm the crop top mom, this like who's the 40 year old with teenagers. And I wear blue mascara like so often because it is fun, but it's not perhaps normal.
Jamie Fearn (01:13:07.668)
Thanks.
Jamie Fearn (01:13:12.268)
I love that. Love that.
Bonnie (01:13:19.714)
and so but
Jamie Fearn (01:13:22.612)
So, but here's the interesting thing because if you think about even fashion, you could go into the history of it and you could talk about the different houses and you could talk about who's really dictated. You could watch the Devil Wears Prada and you could do the studying because that's, you know, classic film to watch if you need to know more about fashion. It's fantastic.
Bonnie (01:13:46.89)
I love that movie. And Hathaway is my doppelganger, so.
Jamie Fearn (01:13:52.392)
Oh, very nice. I don't know what mine would be. I have been told that I look like that girl from the show from the 80s that died.
Bonnie (01:14:01.17)
Okay.
Jamie Fearn (01:14:02.996)
Twin Peaks, I believe it was called. Then she's in one scene and then she's dead. And I was like, great. Oh, cute. Oh, great. So do I look like her when she's dead or do I look like her when they do the flashbacks of her life? Some days it's probably different than others, you know? Anyway, going back to fashion, you could talk about the houses and it kind of brings you back to that same debate of like classical versus whatever, or like the rule versus
Bonnie (01:14:04.878)
Okay, I don't know if I've seen it. Okay, you're like, that's helpful. Thank you very much.
Jamie Fearn (01:14:32.956)
the general population and I also this is this is controversial but I think a lot of fashion is kind of a hack too like I just don't give a shit I'm gonna wear what I'm gonna wear I'm gonna feel cool and if it's not trendy I don't fucking care anymore because it makes me feel good I look good I know I look good come on like if somebody said something about how over-the-knee boots were out
or something and I didn't realize that and I have two pairs because they look fucking hot and I like them and that is probably all that matters to me. So like I think it's fashion is a really interesting there are a lot of different theories about it and it's a very interesting subject to study if you want to nerd out about that because it is kind of that same idea of like who gets to set the rules, who gets to break the rules.
Bonnie (01:15:11.243)
Mm-hmm.
Bonnie (01:15:30.058)
Mm-hmm.
Jamie Fearn (01:15:30.636)
I would like to think that we can all break the rules, because maybe there aren't even that many rules, because who's putting them in place? People that are currently, you know, that have, you know, current power or whatever, but like, it just, it really doesn't, to me, I don't care. Like, if I feel confident in something, I want to wear it. It's also, it goes into, you mentioned, I think at the beginning,
Bonnie (01:15:38.3)
Mm-hmm.
Jamie Fearn (01:15:55.304)
that I've had an interest in like sustainability and I do try to thrift a lot of my clothing as much as I can, but also.
the idea of like micro trends and stuff and there is a lot of there are there is a lot of clothing being made right now very quickly and it's all being sold to fit these trends that are coming up out of nowhere with the advent of you know like videos or
content from
Jamie Fearn (01:16:52.84)
So then all of a sudden everyone jumped on that video and they made their own videos and they saw it as an opportunity to make one. So the idea that even within fashion, there are people who are, you know, they're trying to make it seem like it's this thing that you can or cannot be a part of, but you can be a part of it if you wear clothes. And even if you don't wear clothes, because arguably that is a choice also, you know? And I feel like you could do a little bit of both.
Bonnie (01:16:57.099)
Mmm.
Bonnie (01:17:02.01)
Yeah.
Bonnie (01:17:12.203)
Mmm.
Bonnie (01:17:16.97)
Yeah. Mmm.
Bonnie (01:17:24.32)
So really this podcast is all about how to, how there may or may not be rules and how we may or may not follow them or how we may or may not make our own rules.
Jamie Fearn (01:17:32.776)
Hmm. Why don't we do it? Yeah. And I say that, it's so funny, I just realized this. I say that in class now too. I say, I've started, people in Pilates are, again, if you wanna study something interesting, study the history and the current situations going on in Pilates world, you could find out some weird wacky shit. But the...
Bonnie (01:17:43.214)
Mm-hmm.
Jamie Fearn (01:17:56.948)
in classes people are so serious. I don't get it. I don't know where this came from, but people think that you would think they were either operating on someone or being operated on. And so I am constantly telling people, here's what we're going to do. If that doesn't work, try this. And also remember, it's really not that serious. And then I also like to remind people, and I say this in class and maybe some people would, you know, put my head on a stake for it, but
Bonnie (01:18:16.482)
Mm-hmm.
Jamie Fearn (01:18:25.852)
there aren't that many rules, you know? Like, there really aren't. There are a few. And sometimes I'll say, well, there are a few and everyone laughs and ha ha. It's like a joke that I've used for a while and maybe it's time to find a different joke. But there really aren't that many and we make so many for ourselves or we're told there are so many.
Bonnie (01:18:28.992)
Mm-hmm.
Bonnie (01:18:42.53)
Mm-hmm.
Bonnie (01:18:48.472)
Mm-hmm.
Jamie Fearn (01:18:48.804)
And I just, I'm always gonna make sure that my clients are safe. I'm always gonna make sure they're moving in optimal ways. I'm gonna give them options. I'm going to work with their bodies and I'm going to do the best I can to protect their bodies in the space because that is my job. But I'm not gonna sit there and give them a bunch of rules that aren't serving them because there really aren't that many. Can you move? Great, you're doing it.
Bonnie (01:19:11.671)
Mm-hmm.
Jamie Fearn (01:19:16.425)
You know?
Bonnie (01:19:16.542)
Yeah. Well, and how that pertains to kind of everything, right? And, and there are, and there is like a dogma. And I think this is where maybe instructors like yourself and me, where we maybe have come from backgrounds and from cultures and from upbringings where there was a lot of rules. And so now we've landed into movement communities where they also stemmed from places where there's been a lot of rules and we're like, but you know, do there have to be actually.
Jamie Fearn (01:19:21.648)
What the heck?
Bonnie (01:19:44.522)
You're like, I'm going to mix dance. I'm going to mix Pilates. I'm going to mix strength training. I'm going to weave this together where, I mean, that's what I do. And we're like, okay, well, let's pull all these things together. I mean, that you made a theater reference, right? So you're like, and fashion and that's like, are there actually any rules here? I mean, this reminds me of Mary Oliver. Love Mary. Three things to remember. This is her poem. It's very short. As long as you're dancing, you can break the rules.
Jamie Fearn (01:19:53.904)
some say as though how many rats in there? Yeah.
Bonnie (01:20:14.238)
Sometimes breaking the rules is just extending the rules. Sometimes there are no rules.
Jamie Fearn (01:20:23.196)
Mm.
Bonnie (01:20:24.146)
And that is like probably one of my favorite little poems of hers. Yeah.
Jamie Fearn (01:20:31.056)
Yeah, I can see why. I feel like that also holds a very interesting meaning to me, having been a ballerina, you know? And there were so many rules. And I didn't meet most of them. I couldn't possibly keep up with most of them. And now I have a couple friends that I've met here in Seattle who...
Bonnie (01:20:41.013)
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Bonnie (01:20:48.588)
Yeah.
Jamie Fearn (01:20:55.684)
We want to go, one of them is a heels class instructor. And she's like, let's get you into some heels classes where like you're wearing heels and you're dancing around and it's kind of fun and it's all slutty. And like, you know, that's very different than classical ballet, I will tell you. If you've never seen either of those, just know they're very different. And yeah, it's, I'm, I also don't, well,
Bonnie (01:21:02.982)
Mmm.
Jamie Fearn (01:21:25.228)
I think speed limits are probably good. But overall, overall I'm not really following. Is anyone following me?
Bonnie (01:21:29.73)
Fair, fair.
Bonnie (01:21:34.078)
No, as long as you go like nine over, you know, so long as it's not 10, but even then sometimes I'm like 12 over. So.
Jamie Fearn (01:21:37.948)
Right, sure. You know, it's what happens. But, there, I just don't know how many rules there are. Speed limits? Yes.
Bonnie (01:21:46.754)
Mm-hmm. Yeah. Well, and I think that's where we get stuck. And I think that's where it can get scary. And that's where we maybe are afraid of judgment and where we think other people are going to think we're too much or not enough. Or we tell ourselves that we're too much or not enough. Those are interesting. Like sides of the same thing we're picking up. So.
Jamie Fearn (01:22:03.04)
Mm.
Jamie Fearn (01:22:09.436)
And yeah, because we're always looking for a way to even if we're not, I mean, making rules in and of itself is like a it's kind of like a quantifier, right, or a way to hold things and hold on to them. And a way to ensure current status quo, right. So the break that would be to go outside of it, and you may not necessarily know what's going to happen when you do that.
Bonnie (01:22:30.815)
Mm-hmm.
Bonnie (01:22:37.643)
Right.
Jamie Fearn (01:22:39.356)
But it's pretty fun to try.
Bonnie (01:22:42.946)
Yeah, well, and I think this is also coming from, I mean, not only from yours and my cultural background of perhaps having some strong rules, but also for speaking to our land of instructing where yoga and Pilates, where we learned like a base of rules and so then we leaned into that and then we wove together the things that we have learned from other places. And to, I guess, give ourselves permission to do that and to, you know, I tell people all the time that when I'm.
as teachers, I'm like, you can use anything that I teach. Like use my words, use the sequences I'm putting together. Like try it on. So you have to, there's a form of imitation that we all will do to see like, does this work? Like, and I don't know exactly how to do it. So I'm gonna imitate this for a second. Because you imitate it, then you integrate it. You say, okay, now this has landed, this has not. And then you innovate off of that. And.
it has to and it flows like that. And so I think there's a part of that then when we learn the rule set and we say okay this is how this works. This is the different structures that we're dealing with. How do we incorporate those now with what I already know and weave this together and then build off of it.
Jamie Fearn (01:24:00.232)
Yeah, and I think that's a really, it's also a very, you see that structure a lot just in other, that is essentially when I went to dance college for a couple semesters. And it's kind of, it was the same situation there. It was like, you start with like your classical ballet training and then they start to teach you.
they start to teach you, like they teach you the structure. And then from the structure, they start to ask questions like how can you use this differently? How can you change this? What does it look like if you do this versus this? And even the same with fashion. I mean, if you think about the people who, the people who came up with some of the most innovative, you know, designs, they were the ones that broke the rules, but a lot of them had formal training first.
Bonnie (01:24:57.397)
Mm-hmm.
Jamie Fearn (01:24:57.664)
in some kind of this is how you make a dress, this is how you structure this, this is how you know, and then from there you can take that and you can go all right well that's cool and all, but let me do my own. You know, yeah now we're gonna add a little mustard, maybe a few crackers, and definitely a little bit of cheese. Also love some salami.
Bonnie (01:25:10.102)
But now we're gonna add mustard.
Bonnie (01:25:18.844)
Mmm.
Yes, agreed, agreed. Here we are, here we are. You know, I just, I think I want to.
Jamie Fearn (01:25:22.76)
You know? Which brings me back to wieners and wiener dogs. That's a cool thing. No?
Bonnie (01:25:37.618)
I just want to express gratitude for you too for this one. One of the things I think about as we are coming back to, I think community, I'm thinking about community and the things that you're doing and showing up and building relationships. And when you were here and I was experiencing a lot of low back pain, you're like, okay, Bonnie, come on over. This is kind of like switching our gears back to community piece here for a moment. But I just, I'm having this call back to how in a way,
When we show up with each other and wherever we're at as instructors in this journey of learning the rules, bending the rules, expanding the rules, whatever it is, that we're still meeting people, we're still meeting ourselves in this, we're still building community in this, it's not like a static thing and it's like a moving thing. But I think about you meeting me even in that place where I was like in so much pain and how we don't operate alone.
and how this really is all about community. And I went in for a private with you. And honestly, like one of the moments then as I was standing there and you're behind me, you're like, Bonnie, what is happening with your shoulders? Like your left shoulder is like, you're like not even level. And that was like my pain side, where I was like hiking up my hip, I was dropping my shoulder, thinking like that was probably, I'm probably thinking that was protecting my body in some sort of way. And how it's small things.
and how just putting myself in a situation to be seen by you, and for us as people who serve others and who might be showing up at the front of the room and on the quote unquote stage of helping people enjoy their experience, right? Like the gift it is to be seen by each other. And I just wanna say thank you for that and for that moment and how...
your call a little bit ago about it feels almost like a spiritual experience to watch people have those ahas to feel into themselves and to feel like they're seen and be able to gift that.
Jamie Fearn (01:27:46.048)
Mm. Yeah, and I remember that session as well, and I was a little nervous beforehand because I knew you were in a lot of pain and I was like, God, please don't make it worse. But also, you know, that's a very vulnerable state to be in and can I hold enough space for this? And then it was another situation where you came in, I don't want to rat you out, but I do think you cried a little bit, which is totally fair.
Bonnie (01:28:14.41)
Mm-hmm.
Jamie Fearn (01:28:15.196)
But I remember when that happened, I was like, Jamie, you know how to do this. You're sitting with a person and they're having, this is what you're doing. You know this. You know how to sit with people. You know how to give them space to grieve. Movement, I think you're not the first person to cry in a private session with me. Not that my private sessions are bad. I'm saying that people cry in movement sessions. And movement.
Bonnie (01:28:18.786)
Hmm.
Bonnie (01:28:23.495)
Mm-hmm.
Bonnie (01:28:37.38)
Yeah.
Jamie Fearn (01:28:40.644)
has that power and there's a lot of stuff held up in our bodies that when you start to move and you feel in yourself and in your own space or in your body like things happen and those are the moments where I am like kind of almost in awe that like I'm a part of that because
Bonnie (01:29:01.511)
Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Jamie Fearn (01:29:04.364)
If you're not like me and you can control when you cry, you try not to do it in public that often, right? Like a lot of people are like, oh, if people are crying in a session, they're like, I'm so sorry. And I'm like, why? It's cool. Like we're moving stuff around, stuff is happening. And I'm also very much like an empathetic person and a romantic person. And so I love feeling feelings.
Bonnie (01:29:17.395)
Yeah.
Jamie Fearn (01:29:33.372)
and when, I mean, except for the bad ones, I hate those, but you know, the good ones. I like me. I mean, that's why I love music. That's why I love dance. That's why I love clothes, because you're feeling and you're becoming a part of, you're experiencing things around you like so much so they're moving you. And that's art and that's movement and that's dance and that's fashion and that's mustard. And that's, you know, so many things.
Bonnie (01:29:45.303)
Mm-hmm.
Bonnie (01:29:53.5)
Mm-hmm.
Bonnie (01:30:01.303)
Yeah.
Jamie Fearn (01:30:02.308)
And I think that's really, I just, that's when I think about why I do what I do. Because there are a lot of reasons that I could be doing what I do. And there are a lot of times that I try to make it something other than what I know to be true. And what I know to be true is that I do this because I love doing this with people and I love feeling.
getting people to, the feeling of getting people to come in contact with themselves and to recognize that they can be bigger and they can do more things. It's the relationship aspect that is the reason I cannot get a regular 9-5 job.
Bonnie (01:30:48.778)
Yeah, and I think it's a building relationship with ourselves and their clients. And I think it's also in the same, and like a lovely sort of way, if what we're doing is here to build relationships, it is absolutely appropriate to say, even in the situation with you and I. So we were building a relationship, you and me.
but you were helping me build a relationship with me. And it's all about building relationships, all about how can we pay attention? How can we like be here with self? How can we be here, right here, right now, and be with whatever is present? And maybe that's moving us to tears, and maybe that's helping.
Maybe it's because there's some process of a story about ourselves that all of a sudden we are challenging or facing or seeing, or maybe it is, and maybe that's because we're getting bigger. Maybe it's because it's hard and maybe it's because it's joyful or whatever it is. And that I love that it just is brought back to this relationship and the relationship building and the gift that you are giving and that I have been a recipient of to create that in the world. So thank you.
Jamie Fearn (01:32:05.52)
Yeah, right back at you for sure.
Bonnie (01:32:08.002)
Mm.
Okay, tell the people, tell the people where to find you.
Jamie Fearn (01:32:15.544)
Oh goodness, well on Mondays you can- no I'm just kidding. Um, I like long walks on the beach, just kidding. I hate the ocean. No, I'm sorry, I don't hate the ocean. I love the ocean. I respect the ocean. I stay out of the ocean for those reasons. You can find me on Instagram, mostly as the only place in fake life or in social media world. That's where I am showing up most often. It is, it is Jamie the rat.
but it's more like Jamie the rat with two E's because Jamie the rat was taken. It is a spam account for someone who named Jamie who a lot of people hate for some reason. My Instagram handle is Jamie the rat with two E's like Megan B. Stallion, except with rats. I don't like rats, but I like the idea of rats because they're stripey and they're doing their own thing.
and they're living in walls and all their little tails are getting tangled up together and you know what I'm saying? They're scrappy little guys. People hate them but they still power through. They carry diseases. I don't know. Actually, I don't think that's true. I think that is rat propaganda. But you could email me but I'm probably not going to see it. So I feel like Instagram is just the best way.
Bonnie (01:33:14.228)
Mm-hmm, I like it.
Bonnie (01:33:29.196)
Fuck I love it.
Bonnie (01:33:34.498)
Perfect, and then if people are in Seattle, they can connect with you. Everybody, if you're in Seattle, go find a class. You all have all heard that, you know, like there's private situation if you want one-on-ones, but you might have to get on a wait list for that. So just, you know, put that out there, go find a class. Yeah.
Jamie Fearn (01:33:43.837)
it.
Jamie Fearn (01:33:47.896)
I do have a whole lot of clients right now. But also, I mean, yeah, if you want to connect through Instagram, I really truly mean this when I say, if you heard this and you thought it was funny or something, or you got something out of it, send me a message. I really, I want to be there for people and I want, if I'm saying something or anything that makes sense even,
or touches you in some kind of way and you wanna talk more about it or you have questions or you have thoughts or you just vibed with it, like send me a message and I will answer it within several days because I take my time. But it's not because I hate you, it's just because I'm slow.
Bonnie (01:34:35.39)
Yeah. Oh, I love that you're like, well, my love language is to tell me I'm funny. So everybody please just, this is like, again, shout out to go tell, go tell Jamie. I do this, post the podcast, show that you're listening to it. Let people know how funny Jamie was and to listen to it and we're happy campers, so.
Jamie Fearn (01:34:45.325)
I'm going to guess. If I could get even five people to tell me. This way.
Jamie Fearn (01:34:58.972)
Give it like a rating, like between one and five. Like how funny do you think it is? How funny is it?
Bonnie (01:35:02.698)
On the scale of mustard, is this like yellow mustard or is this stone ground mustard level? Like where are we at?
Jamie Fearn (01:35:10.588)
Yeah, hot tier baby.
Bonnie (01:35:13.607)
Thank you all for tuning in. Thank you for being here, for paying attention, for hopefully expanding. Please take up some fucking space. We wanna see it. Okay, I'll talk to you soon.